[7.1.05]

This July, SCN celebrates our country's independence in the land of the free by interviewing with one of the most talented, creative and politically-outspoken bands out there today: Die Warzau. Their eclectic blend of funk, industrial and synthpop captured the hearts and minds of Wax Trax! devotees from the late 80's with their full-length debut Disco Rigido. The aptly-named Funkopolis followed, and Die Warzau's career apparently came to an end with their multi-faceted magnum opus Engine. A decade later, the band shocked everyone with their reformation and delivery of a brilliant follow-up album Convenience in 1993. Seemingly rejuvenated by the response to their latest endeavor, Die Warzau finds themselves working on a new CD and several other DW-related projects, as well as establishing a vibrant and thoughtful political blog on their website. Fans couldn't be happier to have their postmodern musical heroes back, and the time is ripe to check in with one half of the duo--Jim Marcus--to see what insight he can shed on Die Warzau's place in the 21st century world of monolithic labels, American Idol and the Underground.

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[SCN]: On your website, you mention that Die Warzau began as a performance art group in 1988-not unlike another "industrial" band, KMFDM. Could you describe what your shows consisted of back then? How much did music play a role in what you were trying to communicate to your audience?

[JIM MARCUS]: Before we got together, Van was the Cavemen at limelight, a pretty well known recurring performance artist. A lot of the work I had done was sort of post-nuclear and political. I'm actually a little proud of the places I got shut down for obscenity charges (I did a great "Machines in love" performance piece with mannequins having fetish sex with vacuum cleaner motor driven fucking machines. With the lighting it looked pretty real. We got shut down a few times and none of the groups annoyed by it had even bothered to talk to the mannequins to see how they felt. My personal feeling is that the mannequin community was behind it). Our earlier shows were more about noise and blowing things up, politics and sex. Those had been our 4 pretty consistent points of interest for years, sort of the glue that held us together. Music wasn't so much a part of it as noise was. At the time it seemed to make sense to go see a band that didn't play a single song. I remember a really good friend of mine coming to see our third show. She said "That was fucking great. You're not a band, but that was fucking great."

[SCN]: What sort of musical influences did you take with you when you first started recording "Land of the Free"?

[JM]: The rhythm on "Land of the Free" is made from some pvc tubing, plastic barrels, pipes and an analog delay. I suppose when we were doing it we imagined that we were sort of channeling Neu's Hallo Gallo on Crack or what SPK's Another Dark age would sound like as house music. The head of our record company at the time was asking us if we planned to release "politics, drums and yelling." At the time, that sounded like a great idea, even though I think he meant it as if to say "What the fuck is wrong with you." It never occurred to us to wonder if anyone could dance to it or even like it. I think a lot of DJs were really just going way out on a limb.

[SCN]: Is the name of the band a holdover from the performance art days? Does it have any specific meaning or is something you intended to be purposely cryptic?

[JM]: As of now it is purposefully cryptic. We're just "the Warzau." Older fans may remember what it means but it's not that important anymore. It's nice to imagine that anyone cares what our name means but I use up all my hope just imagining that anyone listens to lyrics anymore.

[SCN]: Die Warzau appears to be primarily a two man operation; what creative elements to each of you bring to the table lyrically, vocally and instrumentally? Do either of you have any classical training?

[JM]: I sang with the Lyric opera for Years and Van Studied at Guitar Institute. Besides that, I don't think there was ever any interest in being real musicians at first. We've been exploring what each of us does lately and I think we've come to the conclusion that it's massively variable for each song. The only real consistency is that I sing and he engineers. Outside of that, it's up for grabs. Many songs on Convenience were started by him and quite a few by me. It's hard to say exactly what each of us does.

[SCN]: You guys are also involved in a lot of production work--with the likes of Sister Machine Gun, Bjork, KMFDM and Gravity Kills. How different and fulfilling is it working with someone else's music as opposed to creating your own? What have you learned about making music during these collaborations?

[JM]: I feel like I have learned a lot as a singer from seeing, hearing and working with much better vocalists. Bjork is just an amazing vocalist and her tracks on tape are just flawless. En-Esch has an amazing urgency in his vocals, almost as though they had to happen and had to happen at exactly that time in exactly that way. Hanin from Atari Teenage Riot just seems to be able to feel something and get it out so marvelously, powerfully and magnetically. George Clinton seems to own a track just by speaking a single word. I always hope I can learn things from people who are better than I am. I am willing to learn things from people worse than I am, too, but most of those people are homeless and hard to regularly find.

[SCN]: Obviously there is a huge gap of time-eight years to be exact--between the release of Engine and Convenience. Why the delay?

[JM]: We broke up. It seemed impossible to actually do what we wanted to do in the context of the existing record label environment. I think we had burned out on the music industry and it made us a little more cynical. Record labels right now are in the dangerous position of siphoning the joy out of this process. It seems like the only time you see that joy and ownership anymore is when artists go out on their own and approach all this the way they want to. When we got back together again we had a real sense of lost time, as though we knew we should have been working together but we screwed up. We let a company try to tell us what to do. What’s worse, we let them kill our joy at playing.

[SCN]: What did you guys do in the intervening years to keep yourselves busy? I believe each of you were involved in various side-projects...

[JM]: Van’s been engineering and producing non-stop since then. He worked with Green Velvet and a ton of dance records. I did a couple of records, including producing one for Pansy Division, one of my favorites. I wrote and produced plays at the Organic Theater in Chicago and developed a number of pro-bono messaging projects. I was one of the creative leads on the Truth campaign (www.thetruth.com), a large grassroots anti-tobacco campaign. I helped found the Safetynet (www.thesafetynet.org), an anti-rape group. I’ve worked with the departments of health in a number of states to try and reach people on safe sex issues. We’ve both done a lot in the intervening time, a lot of things that were important to us outside of music, too. It sounds kind of dull when you just vomit it up like that, though. It’s like “What did you do on your summer vacation”. The time has gone by really quickly.

[SCN]: What was it that ultimately drew you back together again to make another album?

[JM]: I came out to Chicago to sing vocals for Van on an EcoHed record (coming out soon, actually). It was just such an easy thing to do--work in the studio again--that we just kept on going. We were going to trade songs back and forth to use on our individual projects, but it just made more sense to do them together. Even outside of musical collaboration, Van is the Best and most Original engineer I know. I can write some pretty straightforward songs that get much more interesting and unusual when he follows through on them. I guess what brought us back together was the absence of any kind of reason for us to be working apart.

[SCN]: After such a long hiatus, was it difficult getting back into rhythm of working together again? Did you find your respective approaches to music-making had changed significantly?

[JM]: Since we never had a formula, it was easy to not expect the other one to do something a certain way. I think nearly every song we’ve ever done has started a different way. "Belly" (from Engine) was assembled completely in editing, bar by bar, almost beat by beat. "Insect" (from the new Black Massive Compilation) had no editing at all. "Glare" (from Convenience) started out as 4 tracks of acoustic guitar, while "Man is Meat" (on Disco Rigido) began on a dumpster. "All Good Girls" (from Engine again) came lyrically from a story in a newspaper in England while "Shine" (from Convenience) was originally a song written on a piano for my son when he was born. Even if both of us had changed a lot, we would never have noticed it in the way we write.

[SCN]: Disco Rigido brought the dance beats; Funkopolis brought the funk; Engine bought a beautiful synthesis of mechanics and melody. How does Convenience now define you as a band? How does the name "Convenience" represent the musical and lyrical ideas put forth on the album?

[JM]: You know, you wrap a record in currency and call it “Engine” and people still insist they have no idea what you’re talking about. I think that’s fine. I don’t think everyone WANTS to know what a song is meant to be about. That would be the most important part of a song if it were only heard and owned by the writer, but it’s not. Everyone who hears a song owns it and I don’t think I can speak to it and say “this is what it should mean” for everyone.

We can speak to what they mean to us, however. The way Engine was about the mercantile lie, we feel like Convenience is, in a way, about the next great lie of the modern world. The suggestion that any amount of loyalty and intentional ignorance can be purchased with a specific degree of safety, security, convenience--this is such a part of the popular consciousness that we automatically assume that people in positions that maximize personal convenience are bought and paid for.

It becomes relevant when we look around to ask who is not too far gone to make a difference. If you can get View on Demand on Cable for free, is that enough to make you forget that foreign nationals are being held without a trial? Can central air make it okay that our privacy rights are disappearing? Imagine what would be possible for a few extra flavors of yogurt?

In my mind, Convenience was supposed to be "Winter in America" by Gil Scott-Heron, but I’m sure we never came close. It’s just completely real. It’s probably not right to talk about what we did in the same sentence but it’s coming from the same place, I think. There are those fantastic vocal harmonies on “Peace go with you, Brother”, which is, thematically, "Kleen," on Convenience. There’s this great groove--“The Bottle” powerful and just untouchable. There are these amazing topical political songs like “H2Ogate blues” and “Winter in America.”

And then there’s the song I always wanted to write--“Your daddy loves you,” right in the middle of the record, just to make you cry. If you listen to “Shine” and “Your Daddy Loves You” back to back, there is a language in common. It’s the language of parents. It’s the management of the fact that your children are perfect but you are not. In The Prophet by Kahil Gibran, there is this great line about children. We look at it every day. “You may strive to be like them but seek not to make them like you.” There is an acceptance to that which is so hard to achieve but he wrote it and sang it.

We’ve still only ever written one love song (it was on Engine) and what Gil Scott-Heron was able to do with “A very precious time” I can’t recreate. When he sings “Was there a touch of Spring | And did she have a pink dress on | And when she smiled her shyest smiles |Couldn’t you almost touch the warmth” it’s like every innocent moment converging on you and every hope that you’ll be in love tomorrow looming in front of you. Nathan George once said that Heron wrote and sang “uncomfortable truths” even when they seemed idyllic for a moment. The artist’s creed to comfort the afflicted and afflict the comfortable was never better followed, I think. I feel really strongly that this is what we are meant to do, always.

“Winter in America” is just a permanent record that will exist forever. We wanted to just make a record like that that wouldn’t ever have to die. It was just a compendium of our favorite songs in the world. This record is more us than any one before.

[SCN]: Stylistically, it seems that Die Warzau is a band that refuses to be limited by the confines of a specific genre--even one as broad as "industrial." Many bands tend to divert songs that do not fit their band's musical template into side projects or other artistic expressions. What gives you guys the confidence to put everything (including the kitchen sink) into a Die Warzau album? For example, are you ever afraid of alienating your audience with a very poppy number like "Kleen"?

[JM]: I think that our audience has index fingers and know how to forward past a track, but, oh yeah, there is definitely that possibility. At the same time, I sort of think that there is a way to say different things and it’s absurd to think that all of those ways will be consistent and predictable. Above, I was talking about "Kleen" as an updated version of “Peace go with you, brother” Gil Scott-Heron knew that this song had to be beautiful or it would never be heard. You can’t say the things to people you want to say while hitting them with a hammer. “You’re my lawyer | You’re my doctor| but somehow | You forgot about me. Heron was saying “You’re not one of us anymore--you don’t care." And he couldn’t scream that. He had to coax them in. Again, I don’t want to put us in the same category at all. For one thing, it’s a completely different kind of music. And for another, He’s a genius. (We met Gil Scott-Heron once when we were on the same record label. I was wearing a kilt and combat boots with long white dreads and tattoos on my neck and hands. I told him I was a huge fan of his and had all his records. He absolutely did not believe me). The idea is sound, though.

I like how our core fans can appreciate a wide range of music. We hope not to ever take that for granted. I don’t want to go out and say that industrial music fans are just more able to make their own decisions and not follow a herd, but that’s what it’s always seemed like to us. We’ve always been given a wide window in which to work and been supported by people that have proven that they don’t need everything to sound cookie cutter and predictable in order to like it.

[SCN]: Many bands play at supporting political causes-perhaps more for the credibility it gives them in the eyes of their fans as a "rebellious" rock band than having a sincere belief in what they espouse. Die Warzau, however, have always incorporated heavy political content in their songs and seem to be very serious in their activism. For example, you recently released as a free download the song "Insect," which talks about the injustice perpetrated on Iraqi "prisoners of war" in Guantanamo Bay. Could you talk a little bit about how important politics are to you two and what the aforementioned song means to you?

[JM]: We wrote that song as a discussion of the human rights abuses committed by the U.S. in rendering and detaining people without trial or indictment, torture, humiliation and offenses against human dignity and the national trust. The idea was that the song was free to download or distribute provided you told people about what was going on. It was knowledge-ware. This is a good country. We want good things and the people can’t and won’t stand for it once they know what’s really going on. That sounds naïve, I know, but watch what happens when the veneer of corporate irresponsibility is removed from people and they are forced to stand, alone and account for their beliefs. You can only advocate for the torture of a man when you stand in a group, supported by men far away from the act. Remove those barriers and it feels as inhuman as it is.

We’ve never been that good at hiding the things that are important to us. I wish we could sit back and forget about it. The time when you could do that has gone. It’s not naptime anymore.

[SCN]: Does the band have a specific political affiliation? What causes and issues do you feel are particularly important and that people need to be paying attention to at this time?

[JM]: I guess we’re usually trying to remind people that our rights won’t be eroded by attacks on puppy dogs and guys in suits. The front line of the fight for civil liberties is always going to be at the foot of the detested. This is where the government is going to be given carte blanche to write law that will impact us later, removing our liberties by proxy. Given our near-theocratic political environment right now, that group that most needs our defense right now has to be homosexuals. I’m lucky, as a bisexual I’ve been able to skirt most of the legislative and social attacks on homosexuals that have been advanced over the last few years. I need to consider myself Gay as we move forward right now. I want what the gay community wants, seamless equality.

Florida Governor Jeb Bush just recently walked into a church to sign legislation that made it easier for domestic abusers to get away with violence, made it harder for underage girls to get reasonable healthcare and made it permanently (in his mind) illegal for a homosexual person to marry the person they love. Then he told the homosexuals that they were welcome to leave his state and go live elsewhere. Homosexuals, underage girls, Sex workers, Criminals, Drug users, Pagans, pick a population that is marginally represented and generally detested by the public and you will see a battlefield. That is our place on that battlefield. That’s where your rights are going to be attacked.

This war on drugs will go down in history as a giant sad inhumane civil liberty violation that we let happen only because we hated drug users more than we loved the dignity and sovereignty of man. The fact that we let it happen will be such a poor showing on us that we will appear to be a people who routinely cut off our own hands. That’s how stupid we will look to history.

There are going to be heroes like Gavin Newsome who stood up and broke a bad law for every fucking one of us and every bad thought we levy against him will be damned as Jim Crow pandering by a history that will see only defiant advocates of freedom and milling sycophants who refused to get their hands dirty for a people whose problems didn’t concern them. Every other man in his position is the Diner owner in 1944 who wouldn’t serve a negro in the white section and forced children into the back of a bus. We don’t get to pick and choose who gets the liberty promised to all of us.

This is a time in history to be very observant. The rhetoric of freedom is so practiced that advocates of inequity and injustice can use it even as they abjure those very freedoms in every action. The Patriot Act. Defense of Marriage Act. Family Values. You can’t believe words anymore.

[SCN]: You might say that the music industry has changed radically even in the relatively short amount of time Die Warzau has been inactive. Is the formation of your label Pulseblack a response to those changes? Also, how helpful have internet promotional tools such as mySpace and iTunes been in the release of Convenience?

[JM]: A lot of the tools used by major labels are available to smaller labels and artists now. The big secret in the past was that most of the marketing and radio promotion for majors was done out of house anyway by hired radio promoters who worked for any number of artists from different labels at the same time. Myspace is great and completely driven by people--users, listeners. These are the people who are supposed to be in charge. I have my problems with Itunes but it does deliver to the user mostly on their own terms. We arrived at a place in history where technology is being used to interfere with the user more than to provide him/her with services that they want. That is an untenable model. We wanted to reverse that model. At the same time, I always wanted to be on an uncensored record label.

[SCN]: Do you anticipate signing any third-party bands through Pulseblack?

[JM]: Yes, definitely. We have a number of artists that we have worked with that we want to put out. We’re going to be very picky about what we release. We don’t really have any interest in releasing a massive selection of mediocre records. It seems like smaller labels release so many records because they have to while at the same time, larger labels do it because they can. We just want to put out our favorite albums.

[SCN]: According to the Pulseblack website, you've got a lot of projects in the works! Could you give us a little background on the following--

1) "Republic";
2) "Hitler's Brain";
3) The Chemlab remix;
4) The yet-unnamed Die Warzau remix album;

[JM]: Republic is an unreleased DW record we did with a bunch of friends. It’s noise and live and we wrote all the songs in 2 weeks. It was an experiment building a new studio and it was recorded live at a party. "Hitler’s Brain" is on an EP we did with George Clinton called Massacre. We are releasing that shortly. We’ve been trading remixes with Chemlab and building an album full of remixes of our stuff. All of these are nearly finished and we really like them. We’re looking forward to putting out a few fun things next. We just like the record release parties, actually.

[SCN]: One of the most unique things about Convenience is the unusual "rounded edge" jewel case and thought-provoking artwork. What do you feel the advantages to this type of presentation are as opposed to a bare-bones digipack approach like that exercised by Trent Reznor on his latest With Teeth? Do you believe this the era of music downloading is eroding to public's appreciation for album packaging?

[JM]: I have personally always liked the physical packaging of records. If your intention is to make an enduring piece of art, I think you take every opportunity to do that. I think music downloading is making labels believe that they can get away with taking every shortcut they can. That’s not very interesting to me. And it’s sort of a violation of the responsibility we have to the people who listen to what we do. We wanted to use cases that had stronger hinges and make a record that we think will last a long time. We like to think that this is a decision that demonstrates respect for our audience.

[SCN]: Are there any bands out there you feel are doing exciting and revolutionary things these days in today's extremely stale musical climate? What do you think about new wave retro bands like The Faint, Arcade Fire, Interpol, etc.?

[JM]: I think all of the above have written some great songs. I’m a fan of a lot of new IDM and illbient as well. DJ Olive, The Bulbbs, these artists are sort of following through on the promise of trance and ambient right now, turning it into a robust music form. If you put our record collections together you will find probably nearly every style of music represented. I think we are fans first and musicians second. I think that comes out in what we do. We love music and we’re not elitists.

[SCN]: You've had a chance to play a show or two in support of the new album. How has the response to the new material been thus far? How are plans shaping up for a large scale tour?

[JM]: Audiences have been very cool and very fun. We’re trying now to figure out what our plans should be for a larger tour. I want to go on tour with Siegfried and Roy. Van’s a big animal lover, too and we could share a bus with the tigers. On our days off we can play fetch at the highway rest stops with human heads. I think this is the dream for a lot of modern musicians.

[SCN]: Is there anything else we can expect in the future? A new Die Warzau album perhaps?

[JM]: We are working on a new album right now. It’s moving along really easily. I think since we’ve been back together it’s gotten even easier to write. We have people around that make a lot of it more fun and less problematic. Dan and Abel, new members of the band, Xmas, our live guitarist, Jody, our label manager--they all make this easier and more fun. I think the greatest tool you can ever have to make any kind of art has to be friends.

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